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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 14 post(s) |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
85
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Posted - 2013.04.08 17:52:00 -
[1] - Quote
That extra mid slot on the typhoon has me confused as if I should hate the new typhoon or if I should be eft warrioring new fits. That ship really was a curveball that I was not expecting at all. |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
85
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 19:35:00 -
[2] - Quote
With caldari and amarr getting ewar battleships I think it would be neat if each race got a battleship that got something unique. Because the typhoon was suppose to be a flexible ship to begin with, I think you should add some discordant bonuses onto the hull. Imagine if this was the ship:
(per level bonuses)
5% bonus to turret RoF
5% bonus to missile RoF
50% bonus to shield transporter range
50% bonus to remote armor repair range
10% bonus to target painter optimal range
With a 7/5/7 layout (5 tur/5mis) you would have an incredibly flexible ship. Another layout that could also work is a 6/6/7 (5/5) layout. The additional bonuses are designed in such as way that you really can't take advantage of them all at the same time, but the fact that the ship becomes incredibly flexible would balance it out. It would also create a completely new role in the game, in this particular example a heavy logistics, that wouldn't displace the current logi ships.
Not saying that these are the bonuses you should run with, but I think getting past the 2 bonus per ship idea would make the typhoon really unique, especially if the bonuses are discordant. The lack of 8 highs will swerve the ship away from some of the current fittings, but I think the added flexibility would be something that would make this ugly as hell hull (<3) amaxing. |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
86
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Posted - 2013.04.08 23:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
progodlegend wrote:In my opinion while it's cool that the maelstrom is so versatile a hull, it doesn't match what you are trying to do with tiericide, and the changes you have planned for the rest of the battleships. You need to instead define a roll for it, rebalance some of the HP figures, and of course change the bonus's one way or another.
If you want to nerf the mael to the point where it is completely unusable you should attack the power grid. If you hit the power grid to the point where it can't fit a full rack of artillery without power grid mods then your job is complete and only noobs will fly the mael. |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
91
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Posted - 2013.04.10 22:59:00 -
[4] - Quote
Sunuva Gunn wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:
Typhoon:
Minmatar Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+5% bonus to Cruise and Torpedo launcher and Large Projectile Turret rate of fire
+5% bonus to Cruise and Torpedo launcher and Large Projectile Turret damage
Slot layout: 7H, 5M, 7L; 5 turrets (+5) , 5 launchers (-1)
Fittings: 12500 PWG, 640 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 6750 (+250) / 7500 (+1500) / 7500 (+1500)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second) : 5400 / 1087s / 4.97
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120 (-10) / .12 (+0.1) / 103600000 / 17.18s (+1.38)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 125 (+25) / 250 (+150)
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 65km / 115 / 7
Sensor strength: 20 Ladar Sensor Strength (+1)
Signature radius: 380 (+30)
That's one of the best Typhoon layouts I've seen in this thread yet. I'd even support the loss of another high if it could be made 6H; 6 Turrets, 6 launchers (a total wildcard).
That typhoon is way over the top. Seven double bonused high power hardpoints makes it the highest DPS missile boat in the game, and adding 125 drone bandwidth is just a slap in the face to every other missile boat. That rivals the mach which is something that a normal battleship just should not do.
Remove the 5% damage per level, drop the drone bay size to 125-175 base, and add +15 m3 drone bay per level. That gives it the triple threat that people want. Moving a high power slot to a mid power slot added the flexibility to the typhoon that it needed, along with the base EHP buff.
Schmell wrote:Oh you dont realize yet how powerful explosion velocity bonus is. Its not weaker, it is much much stronger than raven.
The issue isn't which one is stronger, it's that they are way too similar. Other than tanking choice they were functional mirrors of each other in PvP. |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
91
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Posted - 2013.04.10 23:31:00 -
[5] - Quote
Rebecha Pucontis wrote:Check out the updated fitting proposed in the previous post. It is much toned down but still retain the minmatar unique flavour.
Yeah, I just saw that double bonused 7 highs and /facepalm. I want the typhoon to be unique (although I think the geddon is going to knock it off as the utiliship), but it needs to be balanced at the same time. Trading a high for a mid added a ton of utility IMO, and the base EHP changes rounded it out nicely.
It's just the conflict over a 6th launcher or a 125/200 drone bay. They can't do both, so they have to decide if they want to make the vocal bittervets happy or finish the mis-matar progression. |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
95
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Posted - 2013.04.11 16:43:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dredastttarm wrote:Anyone else think that maybe the Minmatar should have 2 attack battleships and 1 combat battleship? Wouldn't that make more sense for the Minmatar? Also, I am completely pissed about the phoon becoming another Caldari ship... Don't we have enough shield/missile ships already?
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Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
101
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Posted - 2013.04.12 00:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
Deerin wrote:Dear CCP Rise
I have a question about ship bonuses in geeral. The only new bonuses were geddon neut and domi range bonuses. Would you be receptive to new bonus proposals?
Possible new bonuses for minmatar would be: web range, painter effectiveness, speed, less heat on prop mods, less heat on projectiles etc.
Pest could use a single 7.5% rof bonus with an additional bonus to supplement it. This would leave the alpha role to mael and create a chance to diversify pest
I respect your opinion quite a bit Deerin, but I hate when people suggest 7.5% RoF bonuses. It just feels like a sneaky way to avoid giving up damage so they can put a 3rd hull bonus on. More specifically:
Damage bonus with 5% damage/level + 5% RoF/level at level 5 = 66.7% increase in turret damage
Damage bonus with 7.5% RoF/level at level 5 = 60% increase in turret damage
I think that hardly qualifies as giving much up when negotiating another bonus on a hull, and I think it's too much to give a basic tech 1 ship. |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
101
|
Posted - 2013.04.12 04:37:00 -
[8] - Quote
Akturous wrote:It would be too much if you had 7 turrets on the Pest, but you don't, you have 6, so even with the double bonus it has currently, damage is still poor. This is ok mind, because it has two utility highs and tracking enhancers are OP. But when they get bought back into line, it'll have a lot less damage projection.
You mean too much for a t1 ship like...IDK Drone damage/hp AND Neut range?
I understand the damage projection issue with the tempest, but it is what it is. As it stands a tempest still has 10 effective turrets on it, so it's not that terrible. I'll also agree that everything the tempest does it does because it has 2 utility highs, that seems to be the cornerstone of the ship. It's also why all the roles it fills are so niche.
I really don't know how hard the TE nerf is going to hit the ship. It's hitting a lot of ships at the same time, but minnie ships are by far the most reliant on falloff, so it will probably hit them the most. Only time will tell.
I'm not even going to argue the geddon changes, I feel like we're looking at a freight train coming our way and we can't get out of the way. That ship is going to be a terror in PvP, and I would be suprised if some of the big alliances aren't already queuing up large manufacturing jobs of geddons.
But I just cringe when people suggest a 7.5% RoF/level increase on normal ships. I think I saw someone suggest it for a 8/4/7 typhoon and I was like...13.3 effective turrets and a 125 drone bay is balanced in your mind? It's like many people don't realize how potent that bonus is. |
Ersahi Kir
Freelance Mining Company
103
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Posted - 2013.04.12 08:12:00 -
[9] - Quote
Deerin wrote:Ersahi Kir wrote:Deerin wrote:Dear CCP Rise
I have a question about ship bonuses in geeral. The only new bonuses were geddon neut and domi range bonuses. Would you be receptive to new bonus proposals?
Possible new bonuses for minmatar would be: web range, painter effectiveness, speed, less heat on prop mods, less heat on projectiles etc.
Pest could use a single 7.5% rof bonus with an additional bonus to supplement it. This would leave the alpha role to mael and create a chance to diversify pest I respect your opinion quite a bit Deerin, but I hate when people suggest 7.5% RoF bonuses. It just feels like a sneaky way to avoid giving up damage so they can put a 3rd hull bonus on. More specifically: Damage bonus with 5% damage/level + 5% RoF/level at level 5 = 66.7% increase in turret damage Damage bonus with 7.5% RoF/level at level 5 = 60% increase in turret damage I think that hardly qualifies as giving much up when negotiating another bonus on a hull, and I think it's too much to give a basic tech 1 ship. I agree...but it is already provided to another hull. Look at hyperion. It has a 10% per level damage bonus (which would be insane on a pest...think alpha) AND a rep bonus. Tempest, as it is, is overshadowed by other ships. Needs a flavour. A unique, but not that powerful, bonus would do that. I used 7.5 rof to open space for that new bonus.
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Ersahi Kir
Infinite Mobility
SpaceMonkey's Alliance
163
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Posted - 2013.05.15 23:07:00 -
[10] - Quote
I almost want the tempest to be turned into a snipe-y ship. 8-9 effective turrets but +50% optimal. With the change to tracking enhancers it may differentiate itself from the maelstrom with extreme long range (200 km+ optimal). |
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Ersahi Kir
Infinite Mobility
SpaceMonkey's Alliance
175
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Posted - 2013.05.21 19:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:Again, don't worry, if Tempest is clearly broken after Odyssey, we'll fix it.
The question is are you guys willing to go back and make major changes to the ship, such as a slot layout change or hull bonus change, if that's what it would take to fix the ship? I'm not convinced from what I've seen on second pass changes so far, which have only been a dash of powergrid, a bit of extra drone m3, or a slight tweek to mass.
Currently a battleship that's under performing can still see use because of extreme price differences, once Odyssey hits it all comes down to role and performance. I'm not convinced that the tempest will measure up. |
Ersahi Kir
Infinite Mobility
SpaceMonkey's Alliance
179
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Posted - 2013.05.23 20:48:00 -
[12] - Quote
Leto Atal wrote:Oh my, what have you done to the Typhoon?
They change the regular typhoon so minmatar pilots who come using missiles can move into a batteship.
If they didn't a minmatar pilot who gets into a cyclone has to either cross train into caldari boats, or they have to train drone and projectile skills so they can move into a typhoon.
And honestly the fleet typhoon does a good job of keeping the typhoon flexibility intact, even though it is losing a low.
The tempest and the fleet tempest are the only boats I'm worried about. The tempest got better with the recent change, but it still doesn't seem to do anything very well. It just doesn't do anything more responsively now. |
Ersahi Kir
Infinite Mobility
SpaceMonkey's Alliance
179
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 20:57:00 -
[13] - Quote
Sunuva Gunn wrote:Ersahi Kir wrote:Leto Atal wrote:Oh my, what have you done to the Typhoon? They change the regular typhoon so minmatar pilots who come using missiles can move into a batteship. If they didn't a minmatar pilot who gets into a cyclone has to either cross train into caldari boats, or they have to train drone and projectile skills so they can move into a typhoon. And honestly the fleet typhoon does a good job of keeping the typhoon flexibility intact, even though it is losing a low. The tempest and the fleet tempest are the only boats I'm worried about. The tempest got better with the recent change, but it still doesn't seem to do anything very well. It just doesn't do anything more responsively now. Question: Why didn't they make the Tempest into a Missile Boat?
That I don't know. If they would have done that it may have stopped a lot of the crying on the forums since no one used it anyway.
But they didn't. If I had a gun to my head I would say that it's because it's the most recognizable minmatar ship in all those videos, but it was honestly a pretty stupid mistake. |
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